Dropouts

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  • #28859
    GUILLENGUILLEN
    Participant

    Hi,

    I use the uTrack X32 into a behringer X32 Rack and have tested a recording about 2 hours on both HDD & USB without any trouble but, when I tried with a band playing, I had a lot of dropouts on each storage support… (Sometime 43 Dropouts in a 3 min take…)

    Very disappointing,

    How can we explain ? How to resolve it ?

    Thanks

    #28862
    Laszlo .Laszlo
    Keymaster

    Hi,

    There’s several things what you need to check.
    -The firmware on the card updated to 3865 firmware release.
    -The USB drive must be formatted with uTrack-X32 card.
    Very unlikely the playback has dropouts and the recording not. I assume the dropouts happened during the recording.
    I suggest you to make a test recording on USB HDD (formatted with uTrack-X32) and check the status in uRemote. If any dropouts happens during recording it must be displayed in the application.

    #28864
    GUILLENGUILLEN
    Participant

    Hi,

    I did not precise but yes :
    – The firmware on the card was the 3865.
    – Both of the storage drives have been formatted with the Card.
    – Drop outs have been notified in the uRemote & verified by playing back.

    Bests,

    #28865
    Laszlo .Laszlo
    Keymaster

    Hi,

    Thank you for your feedback.
    What kind of drive is that? (brand and type)
    Some drives are really sensitive for the resonances, which can lead to dropouts.
    Can you please try to put some soft material below the drive an check the dropouts?

    #28867
    GUILLENGUILLEN
    Participant

    Hi,

    Thanks for your quick answers,

    The HDD is a 2,5″ Seagate “Momentus 5400.6”, 500 GB that was in a “Freecom HDD” portable HDD.
    The USB Drive are ScanDisk “Cruzer Fit” 64GB & “Ultra Fit” 128 GB.

    I’ve tried to put some soft material under the HDD, I though it helps but it seems that it’s more depending about how the disk starts the record, very different from a take to another. If the record don’t dropout, you’d better not to stop it. But if it drops, it will drop a lot of times all along the record.

    When I though about resonance in the HDD, I tried to use the flash memory USB Disk but it was worse.

    Best regards,

    #28872
    Laszlo .Laszlo
    Keymaster

    Thank you for your feedback.

    The USB sticks will won’t work for sure, let’s focus on the HDD’s.
    Please make sure the drive freshly formatted with uTrack-X32, no another content on the drive.
    Previously we had an option to create a new take (gapless) during the recording. This can lead similar issues what you described above. Now in the current firmware release we don’t allow to create a new take (or multiple) within one minute. Could you please check again the frimware are updated to 3865 version?
    Once you have set up the system make a test recording and try to create a new take after one minute and check the status on the uRemote.

    #28881
    PeterPeter
    Participant

    Hello Laszlo

    First (again) sorry for my bad English, I’m from Holland

    I’m rely not happy because this weekend I have, for the first time also many drop outs and a lot off error massage / screens. I was on a live gig as monitor man, my x32 full was setup as monitor mixer and record source for 32 tracks.

    It was connect to a Midas Dl32 port AES-50 B, on port AES-50 A was the foh mixer a Midas M32.
    Al connection work fine, and there were no problems on both mixers. The monitor mixer get his clock from the foh mixer M32 > dl32 port a > dl32 port b > X32 port a.

    When the first band start I start the record after while of a time I notice that Cymatic record time freeze and runs not synchro white the normal time. The seconds make some jumps or lost. Also I get the dropout message /numbers, first time I saw this. Many dropouts like 17 in one minute. So I stop the record and start again, this problem go on and on. I get also a couple of time a popup whit the text “no recognize error. “ I was too busy whit mixing so I dint writhe down the error number. After a 30 minutes I stop to try the records.

    So at home I make a test setup and playback the record, also only dropouts and error massage the playback stop a serval off time’s

    So I make a bigger test to check my hard drive, and other hard drives.
    I make a setup, an X32 Rack as playback, an X32 compact as record, and an X32 core also as record and all 3 have a Cymatic card ? firmware 3865 record at 48 kHz the hard drives where long time before format with the Cymatic card.
    The core has in this situation the card form x32 full (monitor desk). The rack is the master and his card is play back to AES-50 A and B port. The compact is connect on port A and get his clock from AES-50 A all home inputs is on port A and also the Card out looks at AES-50 A. The core have the same setup only on the rack AES-50 Port B and on the core all from A and send to card form port A.

    The playback track have only 24 track, in the live situation ware this 32 track. But this is not the problem I believe, because the Cymatic card always record 32 track. Only now the 24 track have for the card no information on the last 8 track. On this moment I play back 24 tracks and record on the core and the compact on the same time. And there are no problems no dropouts or other problems. I make some record for like 20 minutes. Only other drive give me an error when I playback “song playback abort” I now we have discus this problem before but I don’t know the solution any more for this problem.

    For now I get creasy and don’t understand why I don’t have any record problems on this moment its ferry frustration. Is this because I playback only 24 tracks so there is lase information to the card??

    I don’t believe it is the type of my hard drives I used the same as yesterday and now runs and record fine.
    So please can you explain what is wrong and what can I do about this problem. Because next weekend I will make a new record.

    Greetings Peter Visscher,

    Holland

    #28884
    PeterPeter
    Participant

    Hello Laszlo

    After the testing of yesterday, I test the playback in Utool V2.0.061. (Like Take 003) from Saturday 23-09-2017

    And the first records are full whit dropouts, I also check the log files there is a complete list off drop outs, so that I heard that well 🙂

    And when I playback a song after 8 minutes the playback stops! It looks like he can’t not find the next multitrack. In all the log file’s I found that the next track 2 create after 9 sec of starting the record? And track 3 after 15 minutes?

    Also I found a couple of an error like “No streaming message received for last 10 sec”….

    I also playback the test records (take 12) from yesterday Sunday 24-09-2017, and also it stop in Utool after 8 minutes…. When I look in this log file all is oke no dropouts or other message. And this is the same hard drive I used on Saturday….

    I hope this can help you to found a solution.

    In the Attachments you find the log file’s

    Greetings peter Visscher.
    Holland

    #28886
    Laszlo .Laszlo
    Keymaster

    Hi Peter,

    Thank you for your feedback and also for the logs they are useful.
    At the moment still not clear what’s happening but getting closer.
    In your recording log I have seen some interesting thing.
    In the first log you have set up the gig at 11:07:48 in this time the pre-recording started and the device was ready to record. You have started the recording at 15:03:29 (4 hours later), is just came in my mind probably your HDD went to sleep mode then when you started the recording the spin up took to much time for this reason continuous dropouts happened. (you can see the dropouts happening right after you start the recording)
    But in the second log what you provided it is clearly noticeable there’s no dropout happened during the recording.
    You have to think about it what was the difference between the two setup.
    I can imagine the following things:
    -4 hours idle time then the drive went to sleep mode
    -Environment resonance (some drive are really sensitive for that in this case it puts the heads to parking position –> data transfer stops –> Dropouts happens) You can put some soft material below the drive to isolate
    -Lose cable or something like that.

    Do you have any other content on the drive?
    Could you please try to make a recording on freshly formatted drive?

    About the uTool 8 minutes playback. If you want to playback the entry recording you need to import to your computer, otherwise if you play back from the drive directly the uTool can read the first chunk of the recording which is around 8 minutes.

    #28892
    PeterPeter
    Participant

    Hello Laszlo.

    Thanks for your quick reply

    The sleep mode I can understand, soon as I come home I will setup the same drive and wait a couple of hours to start the record.

    I have none other content on the drive it was freshly format drive

    The other option to lay the hard drive on soft material I have done this at the live gig. And also test it yesterday to knock on the table. On that (yesterday) moment I had no dropouts but I will test this also again…

    The cabling was correct because after the dropouts I reconnect the drive on both site, and still I have dropouts…

    Wat I have thinking, good it bee some problems with the clock source?

    Tomorrow I will try to send you all logs from Saturday, Sunday and to day.

    For now I don’t want to format the drive because yesterday in de testing mode al runs fine.
    We keep in contact

    Greetings Peter

    #28893
    Cederick ForsbergCederick Forsberg
    Participant

    I tried recording a live show last weekend.

    Lots of dropouts, most songs of the gig was destroyed =(

    I use a 7200rpm hard drive, placed on a soft pillow so vibrations wasn’t the issue.

    Also, I cannot download latest 3865 update!!!
    I just come to some error page!

    I’m still waiting for reply from customer support…

    #28895
    Laszlo .Laszlo
    Keymaster

    [quote=”Cederick” post=3228]
    Also, I cannot download latest 3865 update!!!
    I just come to some error page!

    I’m still waiting for reply from customer support…[/quote]

    Hi,

    Are you using internet explorer? Some people are reported issue with some versions of this browser, please re-download the firmware file using Chrome, Firefox, Safari etc browser.
    Once you updated the firmware on the card, please re-format your USB drive with uTrack-X32.

    #28897
    Cederick ForsbergCederick Forsberg
    Participant

    I can download the other firmware, just not the latest one.
    Using Opera.

    I get to a weird error page with letters and numbers everywhere

    #28899
    PeterPeter
    Participant

    Hello Laszlo and Cederick.

    Cededrick can you please explain your situation, where you record standalone like only one mixer was active maybe a stage box? Ore have you the same situation like my FOH M32 >stage box DL32 > X32 Monitor and as record.

    I try also to download firmware 3865 after login on the site I get extra option like “software, firmware and drivers” I can download in Chrome without any problem, Internet exploder give me a problem it wil be like text file

    Laszlo in the attachment you find al logs I rename the logs in the same way as the take number. The logs are from Saturday the “live gig” with all the problems. The logs of Sunday with the “test setup” where all went fine and from yesterday with your advice, and with the same drive

    On Saturday I also see a folder take 007 with an error in Utool, in windows exploder I see it has no date stamp is this not also strange?

    Soo yesterday I make some test on your advice in folder “Test advice from Laszlo Monday 250917” you find the logs
    First I startup the system “16:19:47 013 reclog”, and wait a long time before record “014 Reclog” No drop outs so the sleep mode is not the issue.. Dam …

    Then in log 015, 016 and 017 you see drop outs. .. Yes,
    This when I nock the hard drive, when I nock on the table noting happens. I must hit it very hard for the dropouts I go on with less nocking the drive go’s on with recording and no drop outs any more. Soo that is different as Saturday, where I have a constant stream of dropouts …dam again. And get I a new hard drive 🙂 🙂

    So I try again the sleep mode, by hit the table and start the record 018 noting happen. No drop outs and so on. So I don’t really understand wat is happing on Saturday but it is for sure it gives no trust in the system.
    A friend of my use a SSD drive is this maybe better no mechanical parts?

    Then for the 8 minutes stop play back in Utool I remember now we also discuss this “4 months 2 weeks ago #2713” in the topic: Utool V2.0 stops after 8min playback.

    But in the last reply from “Digichtetan” he called this a bug in Utool,

    Hi Peter,

    Thanks a lot for uploading the song. We figured out that the problem happens only in the “target editor” and not when creating the song.

    The bug is that, only one multi-channel wave file is played back in the uTool target editor. We will soon have a fix for this problem.

    Thanks again.

    I still hope that Cymatic find a solution for this problem, because the mixer function is a big benefit for me.

    So wat to do with the dropouts problem can I get better a SSD drive instate of a normal hard drive with mechanical parts and problem when there are vibrations

    And I still hope on a solution for the 8 minutes playback problem in Utool…

    Greetings Peter Visscher

    Again sorry for my bad English I’m from Holland

    Attachments:
    #28900
    PeterPeter
    Participant

    Hello Laszlo.

    I forget in my last post to mention again the time problem I saw in uRemote on my iPad when I record on Saturday

    When the first band start I start the record after while of a time I notice that Cymatic record time freeze and runs not synchro white the normal time. The seconds make some jumps or lost.

    Greetings Peter

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